I first learned about Joe Ebel from his work with guitarist/composer
Ken
Bonfield. I particularly enjoyed, the Bonfield & Ebel album,
Dancing With
Shadows, which showcases Joe's beautiful and distinctive violin
playing in
a modern acoustic setting.
But I knew Joe only as a violinist from the Bonfield & Ebel records
(they
made two together). So to my absolute unexpected surprise, Joe's debut
solo album, Primebel, features not only his work as
a violinist and
composer, but also as a guitar player -- and a really good one at
that!
Besides Joe's outstanding playing, writing and production, Primebel features a cast of first rate players including: keyboardist/percussionist/producer
Chris Rosser, acoustic bassist Eliot Wadopian, drummer Tony Creasman, fretless
bassist Don Porterfield, vocalist/executive producer Annie Lalley,
soprano saxophonist Stuart Reinhardt and percussionist Bryon Hedgepeth. When
you add to the mix fretless bassist Michael Manring and then have
Grammy Award winner David Glasser master the album, you know you have a real
winner.
If you'd like to learn more about Joe and his music, please visit
his website
or visit the Primebel site for more info on Joe's solo debut.
Jamie:
The first thing that struck me after listening to Primebel was that this
is an album and not just a collection of pieces. There are
lots of twists and
turns, up-tempo tunes, beautiful ballads and great playing throughout
the
record. When you started recording Primebel did you have an idea that the
tunes would work so well together?
Joe: I take that as a high compliment!
Thanks! Actually, I wasn't sure how or
if they would work together. A lot of it has to do with the sequencing
of the
songs. I spent quite a bit of time on that, and ultimately wound
up going with
the suggestions of my friend, bassist Don Porterfield. He's got
a great ear for
that sort of thing. It's a lot like putting together a set list
for a live performance
with movement from piece to piece. I wanted it to be an emotional
journey.
Also, I think I have a fairly strong voice of my own. That is, the
violin tone
that I have is unlike most others I've heard. Now that could be
looked on as a
bad thing in that it doesn't have the tone of the well-trained classical
violinist.
But it is unique, and I think that helps bind the songs together.
Jamie: I
think you're right. A player's tone is the first thing that a listener
responds to. When I think of Miles or Michael Manring, I can immediately
hear their sound in my head. Of course, a distinctive sound is only
part of the
overall picture, but I think it's a good starting point for recording
artists. Did
your sound come easily to you or was it something that you developed
over
time?
Joe: Actually,
I have to respond with "both." It was easy in that I didn't set
out to develop my sound. But it did take many years to get it to
where it is
today. I think the biggest change was in allowing my sound to be
different
instead of mentally berating myself for not sounding like a concert
violinist. I
realized that with my electric guitar rock/pop improv experience
I had a
different approach to violin improv and I finally just allowed myself
to let it be
as it is.
Jamie: Well,
that's the real challenge as an artist -- to be yourself. For me,
that mental critic is always going to be there. Sometimes with good
advice
and sometimes just to sabotage me. Lately, I'm mostly telling him
to take a
hike!
Before hearing Primebel, I had only known you as a
violinist, but this album
also shows you to be a great acoustic guitar player! How does playing
the
guitar affect your violin playing, if at all, or vice versa? Are
there any
technical challenges in playing the two instruments that you've
had to face?
Joe: My
history with these two instruments is a bit unusual, I think. I
started
with six years of private classical violin lessons. That's where
I learned some
really basic but important things, like where all the notes are
on the
fingerboard, how to read music, and the essence of syncopation.
Knowing
how to read music gave me the ability to analyze rhythms more closely
and
I was always fascinated by syncopation.
But at age fourteen some classmates approached me to form a band.
They
wanted me to play guitar even though I had never played one. They
obviously
had more confidence in my ability to learn a new instrument than
I did, but I
gave it a go anyway. I got my first acoustic guitar on my fifteenth
birthday
and got my first electric guitar and amplifier three months later.
I played in a
rock and roll cover band all through high school and learned how
to improvise
by patterns. I quit playing violin for seven years.
When I again approached the violin, after hearing a concert by cajun
fiddler
Doug Kershaw, I began to see the patterns in the fingerings, a mental
image
of the spacing and relationships of the fingers, in ways I hadn't
as a classical
student. I could now use what I had learned on guitar and apply
it to the violin.
For the first time, I could improvise on the violin. I chose not
to read music,
even though I was capable.
My phrasing on the violin is very influenced by phrasing on the
electric guitar.
I did a piece with Joe & Tree Brunelle, singer/songwriters out
of Texas. It was
a rockin' piece called "It's a Beautiful Day" where I played electric
guitar in
the style of Mark Knopfler on "Money For Nothing". I added an electric
violin
solo using a wah pedal and distortion. The guitar and violin trade
off licks at
the end of the piece. There are times when you're not sure whether
it's the
guitar or the violin!
I don't see any particular technical challenges playing both instruments.
However, I don't always feel obligated to create a strong melody
line on the
guitar if it doesn't come easily. I can always approach song creation
on the
guitar from a support, or rhythm section direction then add the
melody later
with the violin. On those songs, I use the guitar to set the mood
and use the
violin to articulate the melody. All this is done with little thought,
actually. It's
only when I'm asked a question like this that I sit down and analyze
and
realize what I've been doing naturally.
Fingerstyle acoustic guitar is really the latest thing I've done
with the guitar.
Until 1996, I played almost entirely electric guitar in standard
tuning and
electric violin. Now I play acoustic guitar almost entirely in alternate
tunings,
and electric guitar in standard or near standard tunings. It was
alternate
tunings that opened the doors to all the new songs I've written
and continue
to write.
Jamie: I
noticed on the liner notes for Primebel that you included
the tuning
that you used for each piece. This is definitely something that
helps out
people who like to transcribe, such as myself -- thanks!
This is another two part question... What is it that appeals to
you about
alternate tunings? Do your pieces start by finding a specific tuning
on the
guitar and grow from there? O.k. I lied, let's make it a three parter....
How do
you handle so many tunings in a live setting?
Joe: Well,
there's the obvious thing about interesting arpeggios with
sustaining strings. "Annie's Garden" uses DADGAD to advantage that
way.
When I was doing the tablature for that song, the computer program
I was
using automatically assigned fingerings to the notes. It found simpler
ways to
do some things, but it disregarded the sustaining tones and often
put two
sequential notes on the same string. Though it was correct to the
note
sequence, I had to override it and tell it what strings to play
the notes on so
they would all ring out nicely. That kind of sustain just can't
be gotten with
standard tuning on a lot of the melodies I write.
It is interesting to note though, that some of the best examples
of sustaining
arpeggios on Primebel are actually in standard tuning
but use what I call
"Silly Capo Tricks". "Broken Lullabye" uses a five string capo and
a three
string capo. The high E-string rings through. That song was created
from the
tuning arrangement itself. If you try to transcribe it (and I'll
get to it myself
soon and have the tablature available on my web site) you'll see
that most of
the song uses only one or two fingers at a time and lots of open-string
sustain. When I put the capos in that arrangement, the song just
sort of
tumbled out. Of course I was in the mood to receive it, too.
"Palenque" is another one that uses the five-string and three-string
capos but
one fret higher than "Broken Lullaby". It has a completely different
sound
(C#m9) and again is mostly very simple for the left hand. In general,
open
tunings present opportunities to leave behind the patterns of playing
that
have limited my sound palette. Primebel grew out of
the tuning as did "First
Snow". Basically, it's just a lot of fun discovering what a new
tuning can bring
to my writing.
As for live performances, I try to have several guitars and arrange
the set list
so that any tuning is minimized. If I do it right, I'll only need
to tweak one or
two strings between songs. Like going from DADGAD to DADFCD or from
standard to EADEAE. And the three songs in standard tuning only
have
capos to change.
Jamie: "Silly
Capo Tricks"... hahaha... that's just great! I never would have
guessed what you were doing on "Broken Lullabye". To be truthful,
I haven't
seen anyone use two capos simultaneously before -- is that something
"normal"? Where did the idea for "Silly Capos Tricks" come from?
Joe: I
guess the first time I saw it used was at the Kerrville Folk Festival
in
Kerrville, Texas in 1996. I'm sure others have used them for years,
but it was
new to me. Typically, a Keyser capo is modified with a hacksaw and
a knife
to allow the low string to pass through and the two high strings
to remain
open. What that does is create the tonality of DADGAD, only one
step
higher. The neat thing about it is that you can still use all your
old familiar
patterns and chords above the capo because it's still standard tuning.
It's
like having three extra fingers hole those notes for you wherever
your hand
may be. The second capo comes in when you want that sound in a different
key. A full capo is placed where you want it and the cut capo is
placed two
frets above it. That way you have the tonality of DADGAD in just
about any
key you want. There are enough differences, though, to require you
to use
DADGAD for certain songs.
I then started experimenting with leaving a string open through
BOTH capos.
I was working on a song that my son, Brendan, had written and was
trying to
put a guitar part to it. He had composed the song completely on
a computer
using some old DOS looping program. I discovered after much
experimentation that I could get a very similar chordal, arpeggiated
sound by
using a standard capo on only five strings, keeping the high string
open, and
placing the cut capo two frets above it. The song "Palenque" on
the
Primebel CD was a result of that experimentation.
Another interesting technique with the partial capos is that you
can play on
the 'back' side of the capo where the strings ring through. The
bass line on
"Broken Lullaby" walks down to where I'm fretting the low string
behind the
three-string capo. That, too, is common among singer/songwriters
down here.
Jamie: Some
great ideas! I'm going to try out some of these capo tricks.
That is, if I can find my capo.... it seems to have disappeared
as soon as I
started using the words capo and hacksaw in the same sentence.
Just to shift gears for a second, I think you've used technology
really well
both on your new album and on your website. Primebel is an enhanced CD
offering photos, MP3s and tabs, and your website has two free MP3s
for
download. In many ways technology has become central (maybe even
a
necessity) to what musicians do at this point -- particularly from
a marketing
standpoint. For me, the challenge is to balance the demands that
technology
can place on my time and resources. Do you feel technology has been
a
help, hindrance or both for your work as a creative artist and as
a label
owner?
Joe: Definitely
both, but probably leaning more towards a help. It does take
a lot of time, but I've always been a techno-nerd and have developed
more
than a few computer skills. The internet now is pretty much my only
hope,
outside of a label deal, to get the music out. And label deals usually
aren't
the preferred way to go for an independent musician. There are more
ways
for them to go wrong than to go right.
Jamie: I
suppose this a good time to talk about the state of the music
industry circa 2004. Obviously, there are huge changes going on,
but how
the industry as a whole is going to end up is, in my view, a guessing
game.
But one thing I think is certain is that there will be more independent
artists
at the end of 2004 than there were at the beginning. Lots of labels
are either
cutting back their roster of artists or are simply going out of
business. And
ultimately the industry as whole, and the contemporary instrumental
industry
specifically, will have to adjust to the fact the bulk of artists
will be
independents. The net certainly caused some of these changes to
occur and
in some ways it will be part of the solution to getting things rolling
again.
When you say that the net "is pretty much my only hope" is that
because
you feel other aspects of the industry are "closed" to you? How
could the
industry better adapt to your needs as an independent?
Joe: Well,
I guessed I opened up a can of worms on that one! I've know more
than a few musicians that have been hung out to dry by their labels
because
they didn't hit the numbers or the label didn't meet the expectations
they set
up at signing. I don't want to go there. I'm hoping there is a way
other than
touring 250+ days a year to make ends meet creating music.
As to what the industry could do better, they could probably stop
trying to
hold on to the old way of doing things. I mean, with the RIAA sending
warrants out to 14 year olds, we're in some strange universe! In
my opinion,
the old guard completely missed a golden opportunity to market music
on
the web. But then, it's given a chance to independent musicians
to use that
tool so it's not all bad.
Jamie: If
anything, I think the net offers more opportunities for independents
than the majors now. Of course, things can shift pretty quickly
-- we'll just
have to wait and see.
Back to the fun stuff.... Have you had a chance to play any of the
tunes from
Primebel in a live setting yet?
Joe: Yes,
I have. I've been doing "Shirley Mae" for quite a while now. I use
an Electrix Repeater to lay down the guitar track, and then pick
up the violin
and do two more loops to end up with guitar and two violins playing
at once.
If you listen to how "Shirley Mae", "The Calling" and "Ray of Hope"
are set
up, you'll hear the loop point in each of them. The arrangement
has a little
intro section that I use to switch instruments at the top of the
loop. In fact,
"Ray of Hope" on the Primebel CD is exactly the way
it sounds live (on a
good night!). "Shirley Mae" turns out to be one verse longer live
because of
the need to lay down the guitar track first. I do have the ending
chord of
"Shirley Mae" pre-recorded so I don't have to switch back to guitar
for one
chord. I didn't need to do that with "Ray of Hope" or "The Calling".
"Ray of
Hope" ends on the long rest in the intro, and "The Calling" is a
fade out. I use
a volume pedal for the fade live.
I've pretty much stuck to using only a prerecorded end chord or
maybe a bar
of ritard. Most of the audiences I've been in front of are particular
about seeing
the music being made in front of them, so I've avoided any lengthy
pre-recorded stuff.
I've been doing "Freefall" as a solo guitar piece as I have "The
Caper",
"Broken Lullaby", "Father to Son", "Island Daydream" and of course,
"Annie's
Garden". I'm in the process of transcribing all of the songs on
Primebel for
guitar and violin/viola (because of the five-string violin I use).
I've been posting
some of them on the Primebel web site (www.primebel.com)
as I complete
them. Someday I'd love to present the songs with instrumentation
similar to
the recording, and having it all written out will facilitate that.
Jamie: Sounds
great! So when are you bringing the show to Toronto?
Joe: I
LOVE Toronto! Last time I was there I was working as an electronics
engineer for a medical equipment manufacturer. I was visiting the
CSA
testing labs there and while I was up there (or actually, DOWN there
from
where I lived in Wisconsin) I took in the nightlife including a
great blues band.
It's a beautiful city. Jamie, we need to talk!! :-)
Jamie: You're
right -- Toronto is a beautiful city. And we'll definitely have
to
talk.... 8^)
So what are you up to now? Any new recording projects or gigs you'd
like to
talk about?
Joe: Well,
I'm actually on hiatus from touring at the moment. My wife, Annie
Lalley, and I have been through a rather frenetic last couple years.
In as short
as I can put it, we got engaged in spring of 2002, planned and borrowed
for a
significant addition onto our rather small house, my twenty-one
year old
songwriter son, Brendan, was killed by a drunk driver in June of
2002, we
broke ground on the addition in June 2002, we got married in August
2002, I
continued working on my CD, moved into the new addition in February
2003,
in May 2003 Anne's younger brother died, through the summer of 2003
we
worked on our yard repairing the construction damage and in November
2003
I finally released Primebel. We've had no time to
book any shows, and I'm
not sure I could have dealt with any touring during this difficult
time. But we're
ready now and are beginning to look to the future for live performances
again.
Anne is working on a new project, her third, and I have the material
to
complete another CD similar in style to Primebel. I also hope to
begin a
project using Brendan's music and mixing in my "organic" instruments.
Anne
and I are planning on building a nicer home studio in our new addition
shortly
and hope to give it its maiden voyage on our new CDs.
Jamie: I'm
so very sorry to hear what you and Anne have been through -- an
incredibly sad period for you both. But hopefully, your, and Anne's,
music and
creativity will continue to bring you a little sweetness with the
bitter realities
that life can bring us.
Thanks for doing this conversation -- I've had a great time learning
more about
you and your music. All the Best! Please stay in touch!!
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